Last fall, we teamed up with ADVANCE for a conversation on the future of Rap and R&B at the JUNOS. Host, Mel Boogie was joined by Alexandra Golden, Allan Reid, Dalton Higgins and JUNO Award Winners Maestro Fresh-Wes and TOBi.
Topics discussed include the challenges artists in the Rap and R&B genres have faced as well as the changes CARAS is making to ensure the music landscape is better representative of the Canadian sound.
Watch the panel on YouTube or read the transcript below.
Mel Boogie
Good afternoon, everyone. I’m super excited to be here on behalf of myself, ADVANCE, and CARAS aka the JUNO Awards. It is with deep and the utmost respect that we would like to honor and acknowledge the land we are meeting on, which is the traditional territory of many nations across Canada. Before we officially get started, I wanted to let everybody know that unfortunately, TOBi is unable to participate in our Webinar today. He’s on a plane on to the next adventure, but he has sent us some videos to add to today’s discussion. So really excited to see and hear the nuggets of conversation that he has to share with us.
For those of you who don’t know me, I’ve been involved with CARAS for a number of years, originally as a judge for the Rap category, and most recently, I’m very proud to be the chair of the Rap Advisory board. During my time as part of the committee, it’s been more than just an interest to make sure that independent artists across Canada get recognition, that they’re able to participate in what is basically the highest level of recognition for their craft in the land. And I want to make sure that the Rap category, the R&B category, Black music, period, is a part of that story and part of that rich music history that Canada has built.
And we have so many artists that we’ve been exploring over the past few decades and I’m excited to be a part of that landscape. What’s new is that the R&B categories have expanded to give some more opportunities to Black artists and for the Black artists to be recognized for their work. So we’re going to be talking a little bit about that today. And, yeah, I just want to jump in and introduce some of our amazing panelists. First of all, we have Allan Reid.
Allan Reid
Hey, Mel, how are you?
Mel Boogie
Hey, I’m good, I’m good.
Allan Reid
And just want to say, by the way, thank you for chairing this committee for rap and all your years of service to CARAS and the JUNOS. We really appreciate it.
Mel Boogie
Well, thank you. Awesome. All right. Next up, we have Alex Golden.
Alex Golden
Hello, everybody. Thank you again for joining us and just want to reiterate, thank you, Mel. And I see Kyle in the chat as well. So thank you for all your years of service and helping us get to where we are today.
Mel Boogie
And before I introduce our next panelist, Allan, sorry, I should have you introduce yourself.
Allan Reid
Oh, sure. No problem at all. Hi, everybody. I’m Allan Reid. I’m the President and CEO of CARAS, the JUNO Awards, and MusiCounts. And I’ve had the distinct pleasure of heading up this organization for the last seven years. And prior to that, I oversaw and headed up MusiCounts, our music education charity for three years as well. I have a long history in the music business. I was a Senior Vice President of A&R for Universal Music for close to a decade and before that, held posts at Polygram and A&M Records in promotion, publicity, as well as in marketing. And, yeah, I just had a wonderful career in this music industry, and I love working with CARAS and the team here and helping provide opportunities and a platform to recognize our incredible artists. As you said, Mel, the JUNOS is sort of the high point of being recognized by your peers in the music industry. And it’s honestly a real honour to head up this incredible organization that helps recognize and give artists a platform to be seen and heard in this country.
Mel Boogie
Amazing. All right, Alex, why don’t you introduce yourself formally, let everybody know what you do with CARAS?
Alex Golden
Yes. So I have been at CARAS for over nine years now as the Senior Manager of Academy Operations, formerly known as Nominating and Voting. So basically, our Department manages all of the submissions processes, everything related to voting. So basically helping an artist on their journey to get from submission to nomination to potentially a win, which you know, we have a few winners in here as well.
So another part of what I do at CARAS is all of the ticketing. So if you’ve ever come to the JUNOS at all, you’ve probably come across my email at some point or we chatted on the phone and maybe I helped you out with some tickets. Among other things, I also try to help strategize on bringing members of the industry – becoming more involved with CARAS as a Judge or on a Music Advisory committee like we have with Mel. So, yeah, thanks, everybody, for joining and looking forward to being part of the conversation.
Mel Boogie
Awesome. All right. Next up, we have Dalton Higgins.
Dalton Higgins
Hey, How’s it going?
Mel Boogie
The list goes on and on. Dalton, why don’t you give everybody a little bit of a background on yourself?
Dalton Higgins
Yeah. Well, speaking of backgrounds, your background is epic. I just thought I’d put that out there. I work by day as a publicist and PR strategist and I also work out of a Ryerson, or X University, where we’ve developed this fantastic four year undergraduate degree program in professional music. And we set that up so that University students who are eager to enter the music industry can sort of enter it in a meaningful and entrepreneurial way.
Like many business workers like Allan, he listed off a bunch of things. He’s worked at labels and a bunch of things. Like, I’m one of those types of people, too. I’ve worked in a bunch of other areas as well. I was a full time Booker at the Harborfront Center for seven years, so I’ve booked hundreds of concerts. I actually started out as a Journalist, so I’ve been essentially documenting Black music way before it became trendy and salable, where anybody cared. Rap, R&B, reggae, electronic music, house music, all of that. And I’ve also authored six books that mostly have to do with Black music, culture and identity, including a biography of the rapper Drake. A lot of the kids know me for that.
And I’ve also managed and toured bands across the country. And here’s one little interesting tidbit of info for the under the 25 and under crowd. I even used to work music retail, like, remember when record stores existed? I was a Buyer at Power Records back in the Stone Ages when a bunch of record stores used to line Yonge Street, right? HMV and Sunrise Records.
Mel Boogie
I hear you. I used to work at HMV, too. So I didn’t know we were connected that way. And I know I have The Simpsons background in the back. But in the words of Rakim, I ain’t no joke. And that’s appropriate, because next up, we have the one and only, the OG, Maestro Fresh Wes. Wes, why don’t you let them know, give a little bit of a background on yourself?
Maestro Fresh Wes
Well, first of all, thank you for having me, Mel Boogie, my sister right there. It’s important that – Allan Reid made a great point that he only found out that Mel Boogie was my sister, my biological sister a few years ago and that’s something that we should look at. Because when we look at other cultures and stuff like that, everybody knows everybody is an extension and then the families grow and it’s like intergenerational wealth, intergenerational presence. You know what I’m saying? So I’m very proud of my sister for when I got my shine coming up, she was just like you’re Maestro Fresh Wes, but I’m DJ Mel Boogie. So she wanted to get her own shine on through her formative years coming up. But, yeah, I’m very proud of her. It’s an honor to be her older brother.
And a little something about me is I started out like, 1979-1980 under the name of Melody MC. In 1988 I changed my name to the Maestro Fresh Wes, so the Maestro Fresh Wes was a reinvention. I reinvented myself from that. I was considered old. By 1987, I was considered, like, washed up by 1987, so I had to make an adjustment. So when I came out with the Black Tuxedo, it was a game changer for Toronto. It was a game changer for the rest of Canada. I’m proud to say I’m the first recipient of a JUNO award. I was nominated for the first one, which was Dance category, which we didn’t win because they didn’t have a category for Rap. Then CARAS implemented the Best Rap Recording of the Year, where my album Symphony in Effect won. So “Let Your Backbone Slide”, which is my first single, was up for Dance Recording of the Year because there was no Rap category. CARAS, just like Melody MC had to make a little reinvention. And that’s when the Best Rap Recording category was put together.
And I’m proud to say, like I said, I’m the first recipient. Like everybody here on the panel, we’re multi-dimensional. We do different things. I’ve expanded on a lot of acting throughout the years. I’m an author as well as Dalton. I got two books, Stick To Your Vision, which Chuck D and Drake did a beautiful testimonial to. This is my first book, 2010. And I’m proud to say this is my second book, Stick To Your Vision: Young Maestro Goes To School. This is my second book where Kardinal Offishall wrote the forward for. So it’s awesome to have my mentor, Chuck D write the forward for this and Kardinal lets everybody know that I’m one of his mentors and he wrote the forward for this one right here.
So from hip hop was a launching pad for a lot of different things, which includes, like I said, me being an author, me being an actor. I was on a TV series called Mr. D for almost ten years playing a school teacher. You know what I mean? Pay in full, honey, four brothers, a lot of different projects. Man, I got more to come, but I can’t talk about that yet. But at the bottom line, hip hop was the catalyst for a lot of things that I’m doing right now, and it’s an honour to be asked to be a part of this beautiful panel. Respect.
Mel Boogie
Awesome. And here I was feeling productive because I made a smoothie today, but it’s hard to compare.
Maestro Fresh Wes
Look at your background, your background is clutch.
Allan Reid
Yeah. Exactly.
Mel Boogie
Yeah. But, you know, Wes, you touch on a lot of important points, like being the first. There wasn’t a blueprint, there was no real path that you kind of had to forge. And I wanted to ask Dalton, just looking at how Black music in Canada has evolved since the time that we had to, or CARAS came to the decision to add a Rap category to the JUNOS. How has the culture – the music evolved in Canada? We often look at the States, but Canada has its own history.
Dalton Higgins
Absolutely. It would be next to near impossible to sort of summarize 35 years of rap and R&B contributions to Canada and over the JUNO Awards. But what I will say is that there are a bunch of recurring themes that are always worth paying attention to. And we’re doing this panel at an interesting time in society where there’s been a lot of pushback. A lot of people are talking about anti-Black racism and the role that it plays in sort of, sort of diminishing the contributions of Black musicians in Canada and Toronto, in particular, where I’m from. So one of the big questions we want to ask ourselves is how do we keep Canadian companies across the music industry, how do we keep them accountable once the media cycle dies down? So people have stopped posting black squares and hashtags. So what are we doing now? And also what are some actionable steps that need to be taken to ensure that meaningful change is happening?
It’s interesting because you referenced this idea of the JUNO Awards sort of opening up a bit more and getting more categories added. I mean, that is definitely one. There are a couple of issues throughout rap and R&B’s history in Canada. When you look at the eventual winners and nominees, you see a number of odd things jump out at you and I think people are starting to address them now. For example, when Wes won, “Let Your Backbone Slide” and moving onward, 1991 onwards for many years, like for about 15-20, you just saw rap singles competing against EPS and competing against albums. Okay. So that’s highly unusual. You’re recording artists, you recorded a 16 track album, 30 track album and you’re competing against a single or an EP. So that’s just awkward. Bizarre.
Also, you would see they’re still, to this day, prominent members of our rap and R&B community, perhaps not submitting their music to the JUNO Awards for consideration. We’re not sure if it’s just because they don’t trust the process or they don’t trust the institution. They don’t trust the urors. I don’t know. Right. But that’s something, too we can sort of get more into. And I guess in Canada, when we talk about JUNO Awards and CARAS, it’s just us having a more wholesome and fulsome embrace of Black music.
And what I mean is we know the Grammy Awards, it’s a big brother in the U.S and the Grammy Awards, they’ve always had multiple categories for both rap and R&B, right? The rap categories for the Grammys has always been a bunch. It’s like four different categories. We’ve had one forever until this year, which we can get into. And also in the Grammy Awards, they have, like, five different categories for R&B. We’ve always had one until last year. Okay. So these are some things, certainly Allan Reid and Alex Golden, they can sort of expand on why getting that more wholesome embrace of Black music is important.
Also, I’d be remissified if I didn’t add, I think, and this happens in the U.S as well, when you have these sort of gargantuan rap and R&B talents: Daniel Caesars, Drakes, the Weeknds, whomever. Regarding Single of the Year accolades like, the idea here is now – one of the first lines in one of my books is that hip hop has grown up and left the hood. And what I mean is it’s captured the imagination of everybody now. Rap is arguably, and R&B, the pop music of today, right? It’s that popular. It’s outselling everything. It’s out-streaming every other genre. With all due respect to musicians that perform rock and jazz and folk and et cetera, et cetera.
So then when we talk about Single of the Year accolades, Album of the Year, Artist of the Year, that’s another thing that in our community we’re thinking about. We’re kind of saying, “Hey.” Wes is like, “Hey, I’m the best rapper in Canada. But should I now be considered as far as Artist of the Year as opposed to just Rap Album of the Year or Rap Single of the Year? Should I now get consideration for Album of the Year, Single of the Year, Artist of the Year?” These types of things.
Maestro Fresh Wes
Well, if I can, I just want to interject. When I first was nominated, I was nominated for five JUNO awards the first year of the album. So it wasn’t just the Rap Recording of the Year, it was Single of the Year. I think Bryan Adams kicked my butt with that one, but I was acknowledged it was Single of the Year, Video of the Year. No, sorry, not Single of the Year. It was Rap Recording of the Year, it was Video of the Year. Drop The Needle won that. But I believe it was, I think, Single overall, Single of the Year, man. So it’s not Rap Single, but Single of the Year. Plus Artist of the Year. Plus, do you see what I’m saying? So a lot of things happen.
And, Dalton, you made a great point, sorry to interject, but you made a great point because I’m one of the reasons why there’s a category in the first place. Number one. But at the end of the day, shout out to Ghetto Concept, man, you know what I’m saying? Shout out to Infinite, Kwajo, Dolo, shout out to artists like, there was a little pocket between myself, a ten-year pocket between me and, like, Kardinal and them. Do you see what I’m saying?
And those artists, they did a lot, but they were coming with singles. So what do you do? Get rid of a category? Nah, these artists are doing their thing, too. They just didn’t have the opportunity to put out, like, albums like I did with the machine at the time that I had, you feel me? So that’s why we had to like – what do you do? Okay, Maestro came out, Dream Warriors came out, they went platinum in the UK. But then after that, it was like, you got dope artists, too. They just didn’t have albums out at the time. And for years that happened. So what could we have done? Not put in the category? But I just have to – I know Allan and I, we have a longtime friendship. I knew him when I had a high top, he had a mullet. So me and Allan, we went back. So I’m just letting you know when I hit, I hit hard, and I think that’s something that people forget about. You see what I’m saying?
Humility is a skill we have to work on, especially in this genre, that we have in this entertainment industry. But there’s humility. Then there’s stupidity. And it’d be stupid of me not to remind people who they’re dealing with with certain things, because when I came out, it was like it was a whole different ball game. And I was honored to have managers like Joel Goldberg working at MuchMusic. I go, that’s the dude I wanted to shoot the video because we got MuchMusic in the pocket. You see what I’m saying? So I was thinking I was being savvy back then with the marketing. You dig me? Do you see what I’m saying? So all that it was a team of people in place, making things happen.
And unfortunately, I was ahead of my time, man and it has nothing to do with lack of talent. It’s just I was ahead of my time. When Kardi came out, I had Stevie B who put me out to his label, LMR Records. Stevie B was dope, but he wasn’t like what Akon was to R&B when Kardi got the cosign or what Lil Wayne was to hip hop when Drake got the cosign. But it was enough of a window of opportunity for me to run with this and shout out to MuchMusic.
Shout out to everybody who came who was around that time. But I can’t not give a shout out to the Ghetto Concept and them guys who came up after the Dream Warriors and me. Do you see what I’m saying? Because they were dope too. It’s just that, you understand what I’m saying? Timing matters, but I want to let you know when I came out, I got all those nominations and all that. It was Single of the Year, Album of the Year. Certain men beat me. But the fact was that’s where hip hop was at the time, just the industry wasn’t ready after me.
Mel Boogie
Why don’t you jump in? And then I’ll jump in after.
Dalton Higgins
Yeah, totally. And here’s the thing. It’s great for you to spell out the facts now, sadly, and unfortunately, you’re an anomaly when it comes to tracing Canadian music as far as our music in this country is that you got those accolades. And if you look from 1990 to now, that’s few and far between this idea of a great rapper that’s captured the imagination of all Canada, everybody was bumping “Let Your Backbone Slide.” You reference Ghetto Concept. I had worked with Ghetto Concept, and what was disheartening to me is that they won back-to-back JUNO awards in 1995 and 96.
I was looking for them now to perform on the show because they were great performers and their two songs that won were amazing. And instead, what I got was the performance – there was no rap performances in ‘95 and ‘96. Instead, what I got was the only sort of, I guess, so called “urban” kind of performance, was Bass is Base and Ashley MacIsaac. So when we talked about the frustration, I’m looking to see Ghetto Concept spit during the show. They won back to back JUNOS. Instead, I got Ashley MacIsaac and Bass is Base. You feel me. With all due respect to Ashley MacIsaac and Bass is Base.
Mel Boogie
Well, that’s a good segue to my next question, which has to do with evolution. That’s a theme that you both were talking about. Both Dalton and Wes, we’re talking about evolution, and there has been a lot of evolution, especially over this past year I guess I’ll say with the expansion of the categories. Allan, do you want to chat about that a little bit and kind of what was the driving force to make sure that happened?
Allan Reid
Sure. So in case you’re not aware, we actually created a new category for rap this year, the Rap Single of the Year. And we did a similar process with R&B last year where we’d have a Contemporary and Traditional R&B Soul. And this process actually takes a bit of time. And it’s driven by the community. And when you think about all the different categories that CARAS has, we’re the industry body that helps represent the community’s voice. And so it often takes a community to come forward and say there is a need. We see this all the time, where new genres exist and the community comes forward and says, “We’d love to have a category at the JUNOS to recognize this type of music. This is missing from your portfolio of music.”
The key thing that we need to understand in that is, how many records and recordings are being released within that category? Is there enough on a yearly basis to sustain that category? Because what we don’t want to do is create a category that is there for a year and then disappears. And so we want to make sure that there’s enough there. And we went through a long conversation. Mel, you were part of this with the committee. You and Kyle both.Looking at the structure, the eligibility around the current Rap category, bringing in sales and consumption into that, as well as having the actual membership vote on that category, where it used to be decided on just by judges.
So there’s a constant evolution that happens around all of our categories that Alex actually oversees, along with the rest of the Academy Operations team. We review all of our categories every year and we have Music Advisory committees and those committees’ jobs are to represent and be members of that community. And they come forward to CARAS and say, “We think you need to change this or we think we should be adding a new category in.” And that was very much the process we went through with the Rap category, and the R&B category. Alex, correct me I’m wrong, I think it was almost a three-year process that we went through from their initial introduction of we think you need to split this category to it actually happening.
Alex Golden
Yeah, that one. I think it started in 2019, I want to say when they first came to us for the 2020 JUNOS and yeah, just leading up until 2021. And if anyone is interested in learning more about the new category proposal process, we’re certainly happy to talk about it. And I’m sure there’s lots of communities out there that have other ideas for new categories as well. And it’s a simple proposal process. And we’re kind of here along the way to help people on the journey to putting it together.
And obviously, thanks to the Rap committees and R&B as well, Jen and Marlin, who is the former Co-Chair, worked really hard on that as well. So we definitely rely on the committees to bring them forward to us. But we’re always here to help and here to figure out the best proposal to get everything approved. And we did a really great job this year. And now we have these two categories, and I’ll touch on submissions opening soon because that’s obviously very important. We need you guys to submit new artists in there. Hopefully you’re submitting or you already have. But yeah, we’ll get to the nitty gritty details shortly.
Mel Boogie
Okay. Awesome. Before we get to that, I did mention at the top of the call that unfortunately, TOBi isn’t here. And since we’re talking about evolution and the history of the JUNOS with Black music and the development of different categories, now would be the perfect time, I guess, to input a little video that he shared with us before he jumped on the jumbo jet.
TOBi
Being a JUNO Award nominee and a winner, it truly means a lot to me as a young man coming from Brampton, Ontario. Growing up, I found every means that I could to make music, whether that was going to rent equipment in Long & McQuade and recording at home or finding home studios at somebody’s house in Brampton. And I never saw myself in a space where I could win a JUNO one day because I never saw any of the JUNO Award winners from my space, from my area, from my corner of the world.
To me, I think this will give motivation and shed a light on kids that grew up where I’m from and give them that motivation and inspiration to continue pursuing their dreams and to continue working on their craft, because one day they can do something that’s special and do something that’s recognized nationally. And a lot of people make art from a survival standpoint and that’s definitely where I started. And I think that if my voice can be recognized for that, I think that’s a powerful thing for other youth that are in the same shoes that I am in and are creating out of a necessity. They’re creating out of a hunger that they have to create and I think it gives them that motivation to do that. The award means so much more than you could possibly imagine.
Mel Boogie
All right, so that was a little video from TOBi, who was last year’s winner for the Best Rap Recording category, and just looking at the future of where we’re going, where we’re headed, as far as the JUNOS is concerned, and being able to provide support and a foundation for Black music and also recognize the importance and the historical contributions that Black music has made to Canada. Where do we go from here? Dalton, maybe you can give us a little insight, look into your crystal ball and give us some future comments on where we’re going from here.
Dalton Higgins
Yeah, totally. I would say that – so changes have been made, like people that have been in the industry a long time and if they’re sort of looking at, I guess the JUNO Awards and CARAS as sort of being a bit – the feeling in our community was it was a little bit stuck in the Stone Ages, just as far as acknowledging and just recognizing our culture. But I think to me, it looks like between 2015 onwards, if you look at the nominee lists and you look at the winners, it does seem to be putting more of a mirror to reality and some of our most shining and bright lights are being recognized.
So if you look at the category, like the R&B, for example, 2015 onwards, you’re looking at names, you’re seeing Daniel Caesar getting recognized, you’re seeing Jesse Reyes, you’re seeing The Weeknd. These are the types of things I think we’d want to have seen years prior, people that are artists that are rappers, R&B performers that are clearly outperforming their counterparts. Their peers are getting that recognition on this big stage and that has been happening.
And one would argue too, as far as the rap category, you’re seeing much of the same 2015 onwards, if you look at the list, you’re looking at things like The Weeknd or yeah, it’s just the winners. I don’t have a list in front of me, but you’re looking at it going, yeah, this is actually Canadian hip hop to me. What I will say, though, is even as far as the nomination process because we’ll get some of the pink elephants in the room a little bit, get them out of the way.
But I think it is important that you sort of change, CARAS has changed the nomination process. So from what I understand now, you’re looking at consumption as well. You’re not just looking at artistic integrity and what have you. The judges vote, but also consumption, because what had happened over the years in the past, for example, I can use the sort of Shad, Drake anecdote. Now Shad is fantastic, I know him personally and professionally. He won that award. But what you have had happening here is that you’ve had artists that were streaming one iota of what a fellow nominee might be streaming and selling far less accolades. They could be just provincially known, provincial meaning, just known in Canada or Ontario or Toronto and then having a world performing – like Drake outperforming 2,000 times over. And then that year 2011, he won no awards, right?
So just to sort of avoid those types of situations happening where Drake is clearly one of the top artists on the planet, 2010 and 2011. And then he hosts the Award show. He gets shut out, doesn’t win any awards. That is not the way. That is not where we want to be going with all due respect to the people that won in the categories that he was nominated in. Right. So I think this idea of trying to level out the playing field as far as taking into account consumption, because that also happened with NAV. I do recall, like, we had some meetings I remember, and NAV, at one point in time, there was, I guess, a bit of a silent lobby where they’re saying, “Hey, NAV, okay. We don’t know if the judges and jury respect him as an artist, his artistic integrity, his aesthetics, with his musical output. But he is outselling everybody.” Right. So how could he not be at the table as far as to win an award to be a nominee? So these are the types of conversations that I’m glad we’re starting to have a lot more now.
Mel Boogie
Well, I think that’s the perfect time for me to ask Alex and Allan to kind of weigh in on that, just what the nomination process is like and what’s involved. And if you can give a little bit of insight into how easy the submission process is and also TD’s involvement for the independent artist.
Allan Reid
Sure. Just before we jump in, I just want to say, Dalton, thanks for acknowledging just sort of change that you’ve also seen in the last few years. It’s something that we can’t change the past, but we can fix the future. And I think there’s been a real effort that CARAS has made to do a lot of reach out to the Black music community to address some of these problems. And as I said before, we’re a mirror image of what happens in the industry. And in a way of who’s getting signed, who is getting work, who’s having success, and so bringing consumption to some of these categories is part of that.
But there’s a number of things that we have to look at for every category, from who’s on the Music Advisory committees to who are the judges to try to make sure that we have the best representation geographically from across the country, gender balance, diversity, all these things matter to making sure we have the right voices and enough voices around that table to bring forward those pieces. That started sort of with a hip hop summit back in, I think it was 2018 to address a lot of concerns about the rap category, and so we said, look, let’s just get ready in a room together and talk this through.
Because ultimately, all CARAS wants to do is try to have the best representation for the community. And there’s no other agenda other than we want to make sure that artists are being elevated and lifted up. And so I’ll hand it over to Alex to walk you through a little bit about that process. But I appreciate Dalton, you just acknowledging those changes you’ve seen the last little while.
Alex Golden
Yeah. Just to kind of go over kind of what’s happening now just to reiterate that submissions are open. They are open until November 5 at 11:59 p.m. Eastern time. So still about a week and change to go. It’s a pretty easy process. You go to junosubmissions.ca, sign up for an account. If you’ve done it before, you have to create a new one so something to keep in mind just in terms of details. And then once you’re in, you create your submission package.
And just to say too, while you can only submit to one genre and I’ll come to an exception in a second, there’s lots of other categories that you can submit to as well, including any of our artist categories. So our breakthrough categories. There’s also technical categories as well, so songwriter, producer, engineer, we definitely encourage people to not only submit to the rap category or R&B, but to explore some of our other categories as well. In terms of just to dispel maybe a little bit of myth before going into the new categories. In terms of the Music Advisory committee process versus judges, I know there’s a common misconception that it’s a bunch of people sitting in a room picking the nominees and picking the winners.That’s not true.
We do have our Music Advisory committees. Basically, their tasks are to help us with outreach to make sure people with eligible projects are submitting. Like Allan was saying, help us to make sure that the category is in a good spot to reflect the current state of what’s going on in that community. And then they’re also going to be helping us with screening and making sure that your submission is in the best category to potentially garner a nomination. So that’s kind of the Music Advisory committee process.
The judges are actually the ones who are picking the nominees and winners, and the Music Advisory committee members actually don’t know who the judges are. It’s all anonymous. There’s ten judges per craft category. The judges don’t even know who the other judges are. Everything is done online, and for the most part, they’re voting on the quality of the music. But like we were discussing some categories, do you have that consumption component. So both R&B categories, for example, our judges in both rounds picking the nominees and winners, whereas rap is 25% consumption and 75% judge vote to get to the nominees. And then for the winners, we actually let our delegate body vote on the winners in the two rap categories. I don’t know if you want me to keep going. I can touch on the fine details of the new categories unless someone else wants to jump in, but I’m more than happy to keep talking.
Mel Boogie
It’s a lot more complex than people think it is.
Maestro Fresh Wes
I got a question. You guys are mentioning consumption. When did consumption really become reinforced? Because obviously, like you mentioned, like the Shad/Drake scenario and then later on, those are great projects. Both of those projects were great for what they’re worth. Obviously, the Drake joint and the Shad. Then later on one of my favorite albums altogether, the Naturally Born Strangers album, which was more I would like to think that was more talent than consumption, right? So it seemed like the category was fluctuating, like one year it’s dealing with the consumption, and then the next year it’s dealing with the talent itself or the breakthrough vibe of it all together. Do you see what I’m saying?
Alex Golden
Yeah, for sure. I think honestly, the rap category has kind of gone through so many different changes over the past couple of years. Like Allan was saying, we had our hip hop summit in 2018, which did actually lead to implementing consumption in 2019. So that’s when it started. So the Naturally Born Strangers projects and Shad and everything like that would have been pre-consumption era let’s say. It did get implemented at 50/50. So 50% consumption, 50% judge vote. We heard some feedback from the committee in the community that there needed to be a little bit of a shift to kind of ensure that everyone was having a chance at getting a nomination. So that did lead to last year updating to 25% consumption and 75% judge vote.
And I think what we’ve seen over the past couple of years is that the nominees are pretty reflective, I hope, of what’s going on actually in the rap categories. And obviously we had the implementation of the R&B category last year, the new ones, which is still based on merit and talent. But I think having it split into contemporary and traditional to actually reflect the sonic differences because we did see a little bit of a lack of more traditional soul submissions coming into the R&B Recording of the Year category.
So that kind of, I think, went well. Last year we saw some really great nominees, some great winners in those two categories. And now with the two rap categories, I think we’re excited and we’re hoping to see the same thing getting more people submitting. So I really want to reinforce that submissions are still open and we want you to submit. Maybe, Allan do you want to touch a little bit on the Access program?
Dalton Higgins
Can I just jump in there for a second? Just because we want to present like people – we’re going to get people to submit and take this, but let’s talk about some of the issues. I mean, as far as the consumption thing, right? Just to touch on what Wes just talked about. I think that whole consumption over or versus artistic integrity piece that happened in the past. So the example I’d give to you is that the Swollen Members, so they’d won as many JUNOS as anybody. I think they won four JUNO awards, and I think the feeling in the national hip hop community is that a couple of those JUNO awards, it was tied to sales.
Okay. So I remember one year, let’s say Kardinal Offishall, for example, he was in the category and a lot of people on the East Coast here in Canada, felt that he should have clearly won a JUNO and the Swollen Members won. And I think it had to do with some sort of sales situation or wanting to represent the country as far as Vancouver, as far as the West Coast and not being the Toronto-centric kind of thing. But I would beg to differ. I don’t know that’s in my personal opinion, not being a part of the judge or jury, but I think some of their wins might have been tied to success as far as sales and other things, gate receipts, sales, that type of thing. I’m not exactly sure if it had to do with artistic integrity.
Allan Reid
Let me step in there, Dalton. Just to be clear there was no sales component as far as criteria tied to their nomination, ultimately their win. If the judges were looking at success of an artist that they had and the Swollen Members did have massive success, if that was something that was in the back of their head, they were still using quality of recording to make the determination. But it was only judges selecting those wins.
And again, the regionality, so CARAS doesn’t direct or have any input on how that happens. We rely on judges previously in those categories to make those decisions, and they are somewhat subjective decisions. Each person is going to bring their artistic integrity to what they think should receive that award, but there was no influence or there was no sales criteria touched to those awards previously that just came into play with consumption 2019.
Dalton Higgins
Yeah. And just to add to that, I mean, the subjectivity is essentially at the end of the day, the judges are tasked with being objective, and then sometimes it feels subjective. But that was the feeling in the room in the hip hop community outside of British Columbia is that Kardinal should have won one of those awards and not the Swollen Members. That’s what I’m articulating. And then also, too, when it comes to subjectivity versus sales, I mean, you can see that your sister awards body, the Grammys, or I guess we can call it that. It’s getting slammed in the media by both Drake, The Weeknd they think it’s irrelevant because of some of these same reasons. They’re saying is it sales or artistic integrity? Who’s in the room? So it just opens up a broader conversation about your process.
Maestro Fresh Wes
I would just like to say two things. One, I want to reiterate what Allan said earlier is that we can’t really change what we did in the past, but we could try to fix the future moving forward. I think that’s where we’re all leaning towards and that’s one thing, another thing too. These awards, man, what do they really mean? Like when I think about as a recipient, I got like, two of them. I got like, 13 nominations. What does it really mean? I guess one: it means that my peers acknowledge what I’ve done. It means that the industry is checking for me for certain things, too. But we as artists, at the end of the day, when I hear say, like, TOBi’s on a jumbo jet, you better be in your jumbo jet, bro. You better go get that. You better go. You see what I’m saying? Because this is a catalyst. All these awards, these accolades, all they are is a catalyst or launching pad for us, as artists to do bigger and better things as well as for artists coming behind me.
Like I look at the CBC clip of me when I’m at my first JUNO. I was nervous with my speech because I knew it wasn’t just for me. It was about other artists. It’s a cute little piece I’ll tell you that. It’s nice. It’s cute. You know what I mean? But what it symbolizes to me is the future. Doesn’t mean I can sit back and lie on my laurels, it means I got to continue working. But it’s good to know that I’m inspiring directly or indirectly a Drake or inspiring indirectly or directly a TOBi. Do you feel what I’m saying? That’s what these awards really mean. So we can look at the consumption and we can look at the integrity. But as a recipient and the recipient of the first inaugural one, I’m saying I’m just glad to see artists come after me and do bigger and better things. And that’s what these artists should be looking at as well, because it’s a cute little piece of acrylic. It’s about the size of a giant water bottle.
I remember when I won my first one I was so excited. But then Leonard Cohen, he was receiving a lifetime achievement award. His award was about the size of a grand piano. So they had to push his award on stage.Everyone standing up, round of applause for Leonard Cohen. And here I am with my little water bottle. You know what I’m saying? So once you reach a certain level, there’s more things to accomplish. And I think as an artist, you guys, as a committee, you got to do your thing to continue to defend that and expand and having the rap recording and now the singles category itself. But I think it’s important for brothers like me to be on to say, I love to see artists come and take it to the next level. And that’s what it’s all about.
Dalton Higgins
Man, I have a question for Wes, too. Can you sort of explain to the people tuning in what winning? Okay, I’ll be the Angel’s advocate. Devil’s advocate. No, we don’t do that. So artists that might not submit to any awards, much less the JUNOS, something called the Polaris Music Prize in Canada. They’re just like, whatever I’m not going to submit, they perhaps don’t think that it’s going to have much bearing on them or be able to grow their career. I was a music Booker for years. So I know that when you rack up those accolades, you have something called a booking agent, and they squeeze the crap out of it. They get you more money. That’s what I know. And as a manager, having toured acts, but even for you, as you were starting to rack up the JUNO awards, can you talk about any tangible concrete effects it had on your career booking fees? Like, whatever. Can you speak to that?
Maestro Fresh Wes
No doubt. I remembered there was a year that I was with Ghetto Concept and we were chilling. And I said to Dolo and Kwajo, if we win this, we got to squeeze out some gwap out of this bad boy. I remember telling – these are like back room conversations with the mansdem. It’s like it’s business. This is a business. Music business, family. Understand what I’m saying? It’s like, who knows? All it takes is submission. It’s not going to hurt you. It’s not going to hurt.
Listen, this kid’s book that I wrote, who would have known that this got the Mayor of St. John’s buying 50 copies of this and going to schools in the neighborhood. With the Mayor! Who knows? One thing leads to the next leads to the next leads to the next. So if you have something right there and you know you’re dope enough, who are you to say let me bypass that opportunity, understand? Because that one opportunity there could lead to something else. It’s not going to hurt you. So I still got to hustle. You still got to hustle. TOBi still got to be in a jumbo jet. You know what I’m saying? We still got to hustle, but it’s not going to hurt fam. And if you put that time in, who knows what’s going to happen. But if you think you’re too cool for school, it’s a wrap.
I got a slogan,”Don’t make records, make history.” We got opportunity right here to make our own history. And a part of that is by not overlooking certain things man. It doesn’t hurt Ghetto Concept rhat they won two JUNO awards. It doesn’t hurt. It doesn’t hurt Dream Warriors that they won. Do you see what I’m saying? It’s not going to hurt you. It could only help you. Do you see what I’m saying? Even if it’s a lateral movement. But it could be something where you’re overlooked in the future if you don’t do these sort of things.
One of my favorite accolades is the JUNO award. This one behind me. This was 2017. I was vexed when Tory Lanez beat me out of the tank. Now that was consumption. That’s consumption. But he bodied me. What can I say? But I was happy that I got nominated. I put on my fresh suit. It was custom. You know what I mean? I did my thing. I went to Vancouver for the JUNOS. I was vexed when he beat me, but I’m living proof of this. I’m not one of those guys, that’s a dinosaur who did this thing back in the days and that’s it. Right now in real time I’m working towards putting out projects because I know if I put on the next project from a professional perspective, it can only open up more doors.
So there’s music and there’s music business, and I encourage artists out there to think of that as well. It’s not just about making your music in your basement. It’s about taking it to the world. And this could be a catalyst for other things. If I didn’t do music, I wouldn’t have been doing Degrassi sorry, Instant Star where I met Drake when he was doing Desgrassi. You know what I’m saying? Hip hop was the launching pad. Then I went into acting. You see what I’m saying? I see Tupac and Juice. I said, Let me try a thing. I did my thing. Then I’m doing certain parts and stuff, and I see Aubrey doing Degrassi. Do you see what I’m saying?
Dalton Higgins
Yeah.
Maestro Fresh Wes
If I thought I was too cool for school, I would have had a lot of opportunities missed. And implementing the JUNO award, not category right there – I mean implementing the JUNOS right? There is a real important component for me being who I am as an artist today.
Mel Boogie
Respect. Perfect segue. I know we have another video from TOBi just talking about submitting work for JUNO consideration, so if we can share that and then we’ll get into the Q&A right after that.
TOBi
I think artists should submit for JUNO consideration because Canada has proven in the last ten years that we’ve produced some of the brightest artists and stars on this planet. And still, it feels like we don’t get the same amount of recognition as other countries, particularly the United States. And I think there’s so many creative and talented people in Canada whose voices aren’t being heard and their music hasn’t been shown in a national light. And I think the JUNOS is an important platform to showcase these artists and give that credibility and validation to people’s music that may not necessarily be mainstream sounding.
Allan Reid
Mel just before we jump into the Q&A. I do just want to speak briefly about the JUNO Access program that’s powered by TD. TD for the second year in a row, is sponsoring our JUNO submissions, and last year they were fantastic. They helped fully subsidize six different categories, and we had an amazing response. We watched the rap category double in submissions. We went from 100 to almost 200 submissions last year, and that was great but it also meant that we didn’t actually – it was only two for six specific categories.
So this year, CARAS has actually launched, it’s called the JUNO Submissions Access Program it’s powered by TD and it’s there to help support independent Canadian artists from underrepresented communities, and they’ll cover the cost of up to five categories. So if you’re an independent artist and you are from an underrepresented community this program will assist in covering all the costs to do submissions. And it’s not just about getting a JUNO nomination, oftentimes for artists its it’sabout getting their music heard and recognized by the industry. So it goes through the Music Advisory committees. It goes on to the judges to be voted on. So it’s also a great way just for music discovery to happen.
So if you want to learn more about it, I absolutely suggest you do. You can go to submissions at junoawards.ca. The applications are open until November 8. It is a first come, first serve situation, so if you’re out there and want to have your submission covers, cost or a submission cost covered, I should say, please do take a look at this program. It’s a great opportunity to get your music into the hands of CARAS Academy Delegates and Judges.
Alex Golden
Before we get to the Q&A touch quickly on the new categories. Because some of you might be familiar with submitting to rap recording. But of course, we have Rap Album/EP of the Year and Rap Single of the Year. So if anyone was confused on what that means or curious about what that means in terms of submissions. So Rap Album/EP is for a full album or anything that’s a two track EP is completely fine as well. So what you’re going to be doing is submitting the whole album or EP. When you’re uploading your tracks to that category, and then obviously Rap Single is for singles, they can be standalone singles, so not tied to an album or EP, or if you want to, you can submit one single from an album or EP. This is actually kind of a new thing for us in terms of double dipping a little bit into categories.
So you can actually submit your album to Rap Album/EP of the Year, and take a single and submit to Rap Single. So if you’re super proud of your album, strongly encourage you to submit to that category. But if you have one awesome single that you’re also extremely proud of, please don’t hesitate to submit to Rap Single as well. So not a lot of categories have that where you can double dip genres. So this is definitely something that we felt really strongly about doing when we implemented the two categories to make sure that we have representation across both. That’s truly showing Canadians the best rap projects that we have coming up this year.
Mel Boogie
So basically, there’s no excuse. There’s multiple categories and your fees are going to be covered, and in the words of Wes, you have nothing to lose. Right? All right. So let’s jump into the Q&A my first question here is for Allan. The question is, how is CARAS planning to contribute to the growth and development of hip hop and R&B across Canada, especially outside of Ontario? And how do we grow the profile of these genres nationally?
Allan Reid
That’s a great question. Now I think a couple of things that we’ve been doing again, part of what we try to do is also create a platform for artists to be seen and heard, not just get on the Broadcast but also discover artists as well. So two ways we’re doing that: the first one is the Allan Slaight JUNO Master Class, which we started seven years ago. Gary Slaight and the team at Slaight Music had got involved with us to create this artist development program. It’s not a talent contest. It is about finding artists who have made a commitment to music and their craft. It is an intensive one week program here in Toronto. We bring artists to this community. We connect them with leaders in the music industry. We’re partnered with Canada’s Music Incubator. And it is a very intensive one week sort of session. They also then get to come to the JUNOS, and one of those artists get the opportunity to play in front of the entire industry at the Gala dinner, which is an amazing opportunity.
We also have a series called Rising. Rising started about three years ago, and it is an emerging talent recognition platform. We partnered with Ontario Creates on this. TD Bank has also come to be part of our sponsor, and it is basically sort of mini documentaries about emerging talent and a number of those artists that we featured have been diverse artists. One of the key things for CARAS is we want to help get artists to the JUNO stage, not just wait until the industry recognizes them as a JUNO nominee.
I think maybe the most important thing that we do, which predates all of this, is MusiCounts. We have a music education charity, and it’s not specifically focused on hip hop and R&B, but Music Counts has now given out $14 million in music equipment and resources to understand and learn more about how to become an artist through their scholarship programs, but also literally down to putting instruments in the hands of kids through a Band Aid Program and also through our Community Music Program, which is also sponsored by TD. So we’re laying the foundation for young artists to find their way into this industry from MusiCounts and then also helping them get connected to the music business, ultimately hopefully becoming a JUNO nominee and maybe even ending up in the Hall of Fame one day.
Mel Boogie
Okay. I have a question going to Alex. The question is, what does outreach look like to get artists to submit? And before you jump in I can say from my perspective, as part of the advisory committee, we definitely reach out to artists directly. We’ve written press releases, distributed them to media, and my DMs right now are full of questions from artists, and I’m hoping that the different committee members are definitely doing their part to try to reach out to their networks to get the word out. But, Alex, from your point of view, your perspective, what does that kind of outreach look like?
Alex Golden
Yeah. I think you touched on one really great point and a testament to why we have our Music Advisory committees, and some really great people on those committees is to really utilize them to reach out to those specific communities, to let them know that submissions are open. While we do kind of general outreach at CARAS, whether that’s through our newsletters, through our socials, we target music industry associations, our contra partners, festivals, anyone and everyone that we’ve been in touch with, past submitters we reach out to just to make sure they know that submissions are open to let them know about any new things that are happening this year or new initiatives like the Access Program.
We kind of do that overall industry outreach targeting our CARAS Academy Delegates. And I hope that a lot of you are signed up as a Delegate because you do get access to preferred rates on submissions and possibly get them covered after, even though you do have to pay upfront. But there will be a reimbursement program happening once submissions close. But you also get access to vote as a Delegate in categories, and in the second round, you do get access to vote in the rap category.
So I think that’s definitely a benefit to signing up as a Delegate. And if you do want access to vote in the first round, please sign up by November 22. So just throwing that out there. But yeah, the outreach we do, we try to touch on as many people as possible, but for that really targeted outreach to those specific genres, we really do rely heavily on our Music Advisory committees. So thank you for everything you do.
Mel Boogie
Okay. And then I have one last question before we do our closing remarks, there was a question in regards to getting a better understanding behind the reasoning for, I guess, the inability to submit to different genres. I know we kind of touched on it, but if you can kind of flush it out a little bit.
Alex Golden
Yeah. And this kind of goes across all of our categories. So essentially, if you have a project, an album, for example, we allow it to go into one craft category or one genre. So, for example, it can go into Rap Album. It can go into Contemporary R&B, can go into Traditional, obviously based on music and where you feel it fits best. You can’t necessarily double dip like I was saying with the Rap exception into other categories. So for example, you can’t submit your album to Rap Album/EP and then take a single and submit it to contemporary R&B. That exception does lie with the Rap Single category. And this is across all of our genres.
So same thing with Electronic Album and Dance Recording, you have to choose one as opposed to submitting to both. And that’s just to make sure that people are going into the right category where they feel that their music fits best. And one thing and one process that the Music Advisory committees will undergo after submission is closed is actually listening to all the submissions and making sure they are in the best spot to potentially garner a nomination. So they may suggest category moves if they feel it fits best somewhere else.
So that’s something that does happen a lot. So something to keep in mind if you are submitting and aren’t sure where to go, go with your gut. Take a look at our website: Category Criteria. You can take a look at the past nominees and winners as well to just see if your music kind of fits sonically like some of the past ones. And at the end of the day, we’ll make sure that you’re in the best spot. Like everybody was saying, just maybe as a final remark, we really encourage people to submit. Getting a nomination is hard. But like Wes was saying, if you don’t try, you never know what’s going to happen. And if you do try, you could get nominated. You could win. So there’s no harm in submitting. You’re putting your music in front of some really talented and qualified people who are listening to it. So I strongly encourage you to submit. I’ll say it a million times. Please do.
Mel Boogie
All right. So before I go around with closing remarks, I know there’s a few questions that we didn’t get to because we’re at time. Shout out to Justin representing Ottawa, My favorite lightskin. He’s out there dynamic. There’s questions about removing the consumption component, how artists for the Rising Program are chosen, and where can people go to find out more information about those questions? Since we don’t have time to address it here.
Alex Golden
You can definitely send us an email at [email protected]. You can give us a call, the numbers on our website, but I think somebody dropped in the chat as well. So please give us a call with any of those questions. I think I just see a quick one. If you do have different projects or different singles, you actually can submit to the same category or different categories if they fit. So if you have two albums that came out, one is rap, one is R&B. Please do not hesitate to submit to both categories. You can. The only thing is with submitting projects to the same category and something that we tell everybody you do risk potentially splitting votes. So if you are putting two projects into one category, for example, two albums that go into Rap Album/EP. That’s just a risk that you have to take. So just something to keep in mind. I know people do tend to have a lot of projects that come up during our eligibility period, which is September 1, 2020 to November 5, 2021. But that’s just a risk you have to think about before submitting multiple projects to the same category. So I hope I answer that question but please email us or call us if you have more.
Mel Boogie
Okay. Perfect. And on behalf of myself and the panelists and Advance and CARAS, thank you so much for joining us. I’m going to go around and if the panelists want to have a few final words, just about looking forward and where we’re going and just how we can all be a part of this evolution as far as Black music in Canada is concerned. Allan, how about if I start with you and I’ll end with Wes?
Allan Reid
Sure. I’ll just say real quick, if you want to see the change, help us make the change. And I think that that is the most important thing you can do. Become a CARAS Academy Delegate, have a say and a vote and who is nominated and who wins these awards. Join one of our Music Advisories. Become a judge. We need the support of our industry to make these changes. And you will find a welcoming group of people at CARAS who are very passionate about music. And again, we just want to try to make these Awards and be as representative as we possibly can. So I do encourage you. Please get involved with us. If you don’t like what you’re seeing, tell me. I want to know, and I want to know how we can make it better.
Mel Boogie
Perfect. Alex.
Alex Golden
Yeah. I just want to reiterate what Allan is saying. We’re always available for a chat, for questions. If you have ideas, if you want to propose a new category, you see a lack somewhere or a need for us to create a new category or tweak some eligibility criteria. And that’s how we ended up here. That’s how we ended up with two R&B categories. That’s how we ended up with two Rap categories. That’s why we have a new category for Traditional Indigenous Artists. That’s why we have a new category for Underground Dance Artists.
So we’re always available. Don’t feel like you’re not going to reach a person. You are going to reach myself or my colleagues who are readily available and always around to answer questions. And we just want to reflect what’s going on in the industry. And I think over time we’ve been making up some ground and catching up and hopefully doing a service to these artists and communities. And there’s more to come in the future.
Mel Boogie
Perfect. Dalton.
Dalton Higgins
Final thoughts. There’s a saying change is a process. It’s not an event. So I look at this. This is one conversation, one of many forthcoming conversations. It’s a process. And the anecdote I can share with you is working on this year’s, this past JUNO Awards, and it was kind of like there was this fantastic rap tribute that was created, right? And people seem to be pleased with it across the nation. And in Toronto, where I’m based and involved, you know what I mean? Like, Maestro is involved in that NAV, Haviah Mighty, Kardinal, Michie Mee. A bunch of people.
So for me though, as someone in the industry, I’m like, okay, that’s fantastic, but change is process, it is not a singular event. My question to CARAS is so what are we doing next year? What are we going to do the following year? 2023? Is there going to be rap performance, are rap awards going to get televised are R&B awards going to get televised? So that’s kind of the role that I play. And some of my co-conspirators. It’s not just to celebrate the singular rap tribut one year. What’s happening next year? What’s happening in 2023? So change is a process.It’s not a one time event. This one conversation we had here is not going to cure all that ails the rap community, the R&B community, or CARAS.
Allan Reid
Absolutely.
Mel Boogie
That’s part two, Dalton. All right, Wes.
Maestro Fresh Wes
Just adding on to what my brother Dalton Higgins was saying, changing the process. So I just want to reinforce the fact we as artists, we have the opportunity to create that process, to create that change by our words, understand what I’m saying. And like I said, don’t make records, make history. Bob Marley didn’t make records, he made history. Bob Dylan didn’t make records, he made history. We as artists right now as Canadian artists especially we have an opportunity right now to create that and make that impact. And that intergenerational impact. Because 1989 was a long time ago and 2020, I’m still trying to stick to my vision. I got bifocals now, but, hey, I’m still making music. I’m still growing, and I hope that’s an encouragement to up-and-coming artists as well, because those same artists are the ones who are inspiring me to continue doing what I’m doing. So enough respect still.
Mel Boogie
Still, yeah, the backbone don’t slide like it used to, but we still appreciate you. And on behalf of myself, to Allan’s point, I’ve been volunteering because I want to see change in the industry. So all the time that I’ve spent with CARAS, all the time that I’ve spent with other organizations to try and bring them together, as far as getting some conversations going, because conversation is the first part of the puzzle and that can lead to action. And it doesn’t happen overnight. Like Dalton said, it is a process, and some pieces of the puzzle takes longer to fit in than others.
But definitely, if you want to be a part of that change, you’ve got to put in the time. And I’m happy to put in the time today. I love being a part of this. I could talk about music all day, so I really appreciate the opportunity to host. So thanks for having me. And just a reminder, please submit. I saw a lot of artists in the attendee list and I want to see you all submit. So just remember that the JUNO submissions powered by TD close on Friday, November 5. That’s next Friday at 11:59 p.m. So just go to the junoawards.ca website for more information and thanks for having us and just go have a productive day. Stay safe. Stay healthy. Thanks to everyone. Peace.
Allan Reid
Thanks, everybody.
Maestro Fresh Wes
Thanks for having me.
